Remote View

2mo ago

Controversial question

Antiwork @lemmy.world

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107 comments

Mostly because our ability to organize and unify against the wealthy is overwhelmed by the wealthy's tools to keep us factioned and distrustful of each other. Hence the necessity of the fascist enemy within rhetoric.
The problem is, we humans are simple emotional beings who are really credulous when it comes to being told stuff we want to hear, and the wealthy have crafted messaging catering to this bias and wishful thinking (hence "you are the chosen people and have to massacre all the others who are spiritual flesh-eating zombies")
That sounds way cooler to the lumpen-proletariat than "you're just another commoner, but if we work together we can topple the people who hoard all the stuff and make a fun themepark for everyone!"
- ngl I'd turn against my fellow man if I, exclusively, was offered a couple mil untaxed income instantly from a billionaire
  
  Well that couple mil is gonna be completely useless if we go into a depression or worse suffer a total economic collapse.
  
  You're not alone. Karel Čurda turned in Jozef Gabčík and Jan Kubiš for assassinating Reinhard Heydrich (The naziest nazi of all the nazis, also the chief implementer of the Holocaust. Also the only assassination effort implemented by the Allies). Čurda got the reward of one million Reichmarks for betraying his own sabotage team.
  Čurda would then be hanged for high treason in 1947.

Their meat is oily and diseased?
- You could also end up getting brain worms that way.
  
  We can just make vaccines from autistic people
- To flip Curtis Yarvin's script, they'd make better biofuel to actually be useful.
  
  What about Morty-style psychic shields?
- And you would probably get high on ketamine from consuming it as well.
  
  We could brand it as Special K and introduce a meat line of products
- Some project 2025 authors were joking about making biofuel of the elderly and disabled..
  
  Generous of you to assume they were joking rather than testing the waters.
  
  People like that don't joke about those kinds of things (they typically have no sense of humor at all). They use the guise of humor as plausible deniability for their insane beliefs.
  
  Just use livestock if you're hellbent on that? There's not enough humans to make that economically viable... Hell, why am I taking this seriously, it's obviously not a serious proposal, right?

Look at history. You need a tipping point, but more importantly, you need organised masses and a vision/visionary to get behind.
That's how Lenin got in power. It's how the French decapitated their king. That's why there was a rally at the White house when trump lost the previous election but nobody is doing anything against him now at the states while he dismantles the country.
- Correct, but there is a lot of nuance.
  Indeed, when things get bad, the public is willing to take risks. When everything is good enough, they don't revolt.
  However, successful revolts do require intelligent and capable leaders.
  What the rich have realized, is that if they ensure smart and skilled kids get picked out of the drudgery and get comfortable working for the rich, then the exploited class will not really have anyone to lead them.
  Put another way, in 1908, every factory had a few leaders working at the lowest levels. And they are the ones who spearheaded strikes and such.
  Nowadays, society is really stratified in terms of skill.
  Anyone who grew up poor, but had talent to organize, probably ended up in some kind of middle management or professional job and makes 2x the average.
  Convincing these people to have class solidarity is difficult. Only a few of them actually see the bigger. Those tend to become middle or upper management or politicians, making 3-5x the average workers salary. And of those, only a very select few are willing to fight for the common man.
  So yeah, the rich engineered a system that they can control. To actually change anything is going to be very difficult.
  
  Iran, 1977, mass demonstrations that were often kicked off by communists and socialists leading to a revolution in 1979.
  Iran, 1988, communists, many who were involved in the revolution, begin being executed by the Islamic government.
  Revolution is also sadly no guarantee of anything getting better.
  "The moral arc of history bends towards justice" is a lie Westerners have sold themselves for far too long while the evidence otherwise has stared them in the face if they were paying any attention at all.
  
  in 1908, every factory had a few leaders working at the lowest levels. And they are the ones who spearheaded strikes and such.
  (I can’t be the first person to have this thought so someone please chime in and tell me where to learn more.)
  The scale of housing and factories was different in 1908 though. These days factories are giant complexes in the middle of nowhere with supercommuters that don’t live anywhere near each other or the factory so don’t have the same opportunities to fraternize and organize in their homes and taverns. I don’t know how workers can overcome this massive hurdle from the modern era.
  
  This is a great point that I haven’t heard before, and it seems intuitively correct. Considering overall economic mobility has gotten worse over the decades, I suppose one way you could validate this is by looking at the stats for economic mobility differentiated by… academic success? Measured IQ? Skill acquisition? None of those are good isolated indicators but maybe there’s a good measure where you can say “economic mobility increased for skilled people over time, but decreased for less-skilled people over the same time period.”
  This is not a criticism of your point, by the way. I think you’re right. Just wondering exactly how right.
- I'm not advocating it tbh
  They probably taste like shit and cocaine
- Wow you really picked two of the worst possible examples. French Revolutionaries decapitated so many officials that they ended up decapitating the previous wave of French Revolutionaries, then Napoleon and the Church took over.
  
  My example was about how people get together to make revolutions happen, not wether they were good/bad or what ended up happening after. I chose those examples because in both cases a revolt was long time coming but people couldn't do it until they were organised

I so fucking love this so, so much

I'm vegan - I compost the rich.
- Remember, even herbivores are opportunistic carnivores on occasion. ☺️
  
  For self-defense it's actually okay.
- Vegans like you make me interested in veganism. The diet seems to have some beneficial effect on the sense of humor.
  TL; DR I laughed my a** off, thank you!
  
  Happy to be inspiring :)
  TL; DR you just made my day :*
- It's OK, they consent to it by being rich.

You say the larger of the two, but the majority of the USA voted for fascism and an absurd number of people just stayed home. It's hard to grow a resistance when you simultaneously believe the simple folk are getting exactly what they deserve and asked for.
- I'm not sure the majority voted for Trump considering all the election interference and Elon Musk's fuckery.
  
  Yes, there is a strong case that voter suppression won him the race in 2016 and 2024
- Voting stupidly doesn't turn a working class person into an owner class person. We still outnumber them, it's just that most of us have been tricked.
- It’s hard to grow a resistance when you simultaneously believe the simple folk are getting exactly what they deserve and asked for.
  It really shouldn't be since that's just the beginning, they'll be coming for everyone that says a single negative thing about the king and his cronies.
- Not even a majority of voters, let alone a majority of Americans. Just about 30% of adults in the US voted for trump. We still outnumber them.
  
  And 40% didn't think it was important enough to even vote
  
  Actually yes, a majority. Trump lost popular vote in 2016 but won it in 2024. IMO everyone eligible who stayed home is just as much complicit with Trump.
  More specifically the number of Trump voters barely increased, but the number of people who voted for Kamala was millions less than those who voted for Biden.
- The same people who have historically bankrolled and controlled Republicans also run the Democrats. It's kinda hard to "fight the system" when the oligarchs are the system.
  
  Then you would agree we should remove money from politics and...
  Oh! Whats this? The DNC passed campaign finance limits in 2002 which were overturned by the conservative SCOTUS in 2010 "Citizens United" decision? Huh, wow, thats crazy. Have any Dems talked about this recently? All of them? All the time? Neat.

Because eating the rich will accomplish nothing if you don't also change the underlying system that created them in the first place. And good luck getting everyone in the non-rich class to agree on what that change should look like.
- What if the rich kept getting eaten until they figured out a system that the rest of us were satisfied with
  
  Evolution 101 really.
- The 2% inflation target that excludes all investments you mean, so that we must consume more every year otherwise interest rates collapse and we gush out money like a sprinkler, as the rich load up on debt to short cash with their ever inflating collateral while gold and houses rise 10% a year.

Guns. The answer is guns, Lrrr.

can't afford teeth in this economy

Because that's canabolism
- which is bad, mkay.
  
  It's bad for your metabolism.

Because they taste like shit.
Better to leave them outside for the polar bears to eat so they stop starving to death.

Because much of the working class is easily bought
- And even more is easily fooled.

too much damn gristle

https://morbotron.com/meme/S09E03/134426.jpg?b64lines=ICJXaHkgYXJlIHlvdSBjaGVlcmluZywgRnJ5PwogWW91J3JlIG5vdCByaWNoLiIKICJUcnVlLCBidXQgc29tZWRheSBJIG1pZ2h0IGJlIHJpY2guIApBbmQgdGhlbiBwZW9wbGUgbGlrZSBtZSBiZXR0ZXIgCndhdGNoIHRoZWlyIHN0ZXAuIg==

Because they're passive Americans?

Dont go away. Coming up next on love Island...

Jail. If it is we legal it wouldn't be an issue.
- What if I were to tell you we're larger than the cops too
  
  I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm saying why it isn't done. No one wants to risk it. Or death.
- You can't jail the entire 99% the hardest part would be there's only 1% to go around.
  
  For sure. But the math of those that dont want to risk jail or death is like 99.9 of the 99.

Because the rich don't affect much in our current monetary policy, its the velocity of money that matters rather than the quantity.
If they start buying out every grocery store then prices rise, interest rates rise, and their asset prices fall.
Its the central bank that debases your salary though, making it buy less and forcing a wall of debt to gatekeep your housing.
- You're half right... monetary policy is a huge source of inequality, but that's because congress obeys their rich owners.
  If there was some way to opt out of their monetary policy, then you'd think it would already be catching on. 😉
- you just dont get it, do you? :DDD

107 comments