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Bulletins and News Discussion from July 7th to July 13th, 2025 - Sanctions on Russia: The Sequel

Image is of the Power of Siberia natural gas pipeline, which transports gas from Russia to China. This isn't an oil pipeline (such as the ESPO) but I thought it looked cool. Source here.


Trump has recently proposed a 500% tariff on goods from countries that trade with Russia, including India and China (who buy ~70% of Russia's oil output), as well as a 10% additional tariff on goods from countries that "align themselves with BRICS." Considering that China is the largest trading partner of most of the countries on the planet at this point, and India and Brazil are reasonably strong regional players, I'm not sure what exactly "alignment" means, but it could be pretty bad.

Sanctions and tariffs on Russian products have been difficult to achieve in practice. It's easy to write an order to sanction Russia, but much harder to actually enforce these sorts of things because of, for example, the Russian shadow oil fleet, or countries like Kazakhstan acting as covert middlemen (well, as covert as a very sudden oil export boom can be).

Considering that China was pretty soundly victorious last time around, I'm cautiously optimistic, especially because China and India just outright cutting off their supply of energy and fuel would be catastrophic to them (and if Iran and Israel go to war again any time in the near future, it'll only be more disastrous). Barring China and India kowtowing to Trump and copying Europe vis-a-vis Nordstream 2 (which isn't impossible, I suppose), the question is whether China and India will appear to accede to these commands while secretly continuing trade with Russia through middlemen, or if they will be more defiant in the face of American pressure.


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912 comments
  • With how much Russia is able to sustain toe-to-for attrition warfare against the west, imagine if the USSR, even in its late stages under Gorbachev, actually committed to a full scale attrition war against the West when it continued its imperialist aggressions. Actually took control of Europe by force and kept the West out of Eurasia and Africa.

    Over half of Ukraine’s munitions and equipment is ex-soviet. Imagine if that was pointed West instead of East while we had the chance. The war would be a guaranteed victory.

    I really think prioritizing unjust peace over anti-imperialist principled positions has been the most consistent mistake of the socialist projects thus far. War should not be shirked from over all else or we get Pez and Gorby and China’s foreign policy, which results in the West setting up as it sees fit to pick off the weakest links one by one.

    • With how much Russia is able to sustain toe-to-for attrition warfare against the west, imagine if the USSR, even in its late stages under Gorbachev, actually committed to a full scale attrition war against the West when it continued its imperialist aggressions. Actually took control of Europe by force and kept the West out of Eurasia and Africa.

      1. The West's industrial and military prowess hasn't rotted away yet due to neoliberalism and can actually put up a fight.
      2. The PRC would almost certainly have went to war with the SU, in which case it becomes a SU vs PRC war with the West marching into what's left of the SU after the SU defeats the PRC, so the West can triumph over both the SU and the PRC instead of just the SU.

      There was a brief period of time when the PRC wouldn't have gone to the war with the SU in this hypothetical (ie when Stalin was still alive), but the SU was still recovering from WWII. This is basically "Stalin shouldn't have stopped at Berlin." The SU wouldn't get ICBMs until after Stalin's death, so even if Stalin didn't stop at Berlin, the US would still be around.

      I guess there's also the very end of Gorbachev's reign, but the Soviet political class was thoroughly compromised by that point.

      • Realistically, in any scenario that the USSR continued West (ie. operation unthinkable but reversed) the US would have just dropped another nuke... and another nuke... and another nuke... until they won.

        Russia had no strategic bombers, very rudimentary (basically zero) nuclear technology, and a very minor navy. The US would have happily deployed more nukes until one hit them back; they only started talking about peace after the Soviets surprised the world with their rapid nuclear weapons program in 1949. Even then, that's 4 years of a head start for American nukes.

        • "Stalin shouldn't have stopped at Berlin" is just the leftist version of "Hitler should've just taken Stalingrad." As far as defeating the center of capital, which was already in the US by the time of WWII, is concerned, there's 0% the Soviet Union (or any other country or honestly even an alliance of countries) can invade the US outside of maybe staging a massive land invasion from Mexico and that's assuming the US would do absolutely nothing while millions of soldiers are transported to northern Mexico somehow.

          And this isn't even getting to the real reason why Stalin stopped at Berlin, which was so he could begin the march to Tokyo. The Red Army liberated Manchuria from fascist Japan and was poised to liberate Japan from fascism just like what they did to Germany before the US dropped the nukes. If the US didn't have nukes, you would just see the Red Army march into Tokyo, and since the US wasn't in position to properly invade Japan, there would be no need to divide Japan but have a singular socialist government like the GDR.

          Alt history where the US didn't get nukes is just the same situation in Europe (with maybe the SU having more leverage that they can use like forcing the capital of West Germany to be Bonn instead of Berlin) while the entirety of East Asia is socialist. I seriously doubt even alt-history SU has it in them to liberate Eastern Europe, Eastern Asia, and Western Europe.

    • De-industrialization in the West was made possible by the collapse of the Soviet Union and the end of the scenario you describe.

    • I agree; I think the understated strength of the US and its proxies is their ability to win peaces even after they lose wars, because their true strength isn't really military, it's economy and diplomacy and espionage. The US lost the Korean War, and what happened after? The US lost the Vietnam War, and what happened after? The US lost in Iraq, and what happened after? The US lost in Afghanistan, and what is happening after? Their victories take decades to undo, but their defeats eventually lead to victories by suffocating the victor until they accede to a neoliberal world order. You can fire guns at American soldiers, you can dig tunnels to ambush American squads, you might even shoot down American planes, but shooting the world reserve currency is much, much, much harder.

      In essence: to go to war with America is dangerous, but to make peace with America is catastrophic. I think the decision for the USSR to not go to war against the US was good (as it averted a nuclear war), but I also think the Soviets were just a little too willing to go along with what the Americans clearly wanted to happen; a resource-intensive contest of proxy wars and espionage and counter-espionage and nuke-building that drained the USSR of resources and gradually isolated them. Abandoning Stalin was a critical error in that regard. It's my main worry in regards to China, too. Binding yourself to rules of engagement will make you weaker if the person you're fighting is willing to break those rules at a moment's notice for even the slightest gain, and the US (and its proxies, especially Israel) is absolutely willing to do that, including among the largest terrorist attacks in human history (e.g. the Lebanon pager terrorist attack). I worry that one day, the US will pull out some economic or diplomatic superweapon or new mechanism and all China will do is go "Hey! That's not fair!" and then proceed to not do anything in retaliation because doing so would break the rules, and if they go low then we go high!

      • I think many anti-imperialist leftists are increasingly coming to that conclusion. I recently finished reading Kyle Ferrana's "Why the World Needs China," and I can honestly say now that it's one of the most insightful leftist books published since Domenico Losurdo and Samir Amin. Before Ferrana goes on to answer nearly every major leftist question about China, its contradictions and the atrocity propaganda against it, the book first goes through an impressively cogent assessment on the material conditions of the contemporary world and where things stand. Ferrana's analysis concluded with the view that the "peace at all costs" principle of leftists and socialist states continuing up to today has been, in many ways, a consequential miscalculation. An excerpt:

        Chapters One through Five showed that the United States is the strongest center of capitalist power in the world; Chapters Six through Ten showed that the PRC is the strongest center of proletarian power in the world. Though the super-empire’s mechanisms of exploitation and control have developed since the inter-imperialist rivalry era, financial capital still dominates the West, and its fundamental tendency that Lenin identified a century ago—to ever expand and ever increase its profits—is likewise unchanged. There is indeed a Thucydides Trap—not one determined merely by the military and economic power of states, but also by their class character. In order to grow, the Western bourgeoisie must eventually subdue China. If it cannot do so by subversion, sabotage, and trade manipulation, it will try to do so by force. The super-empire’s reaction can be delayed, if it can profit first by subjugating other victims (such as the Russian Federation and its other national-bourgeois enemies), but the world is finite, and as far as we know, the rate of extraction cannot increase much further; the most efficient paradigm of dispossessive accumulation yet discovered—neocolonialism—is already prevalent nearly everywhere.

        A conflict therefore is inevitably coming, a death-struggle between the American financial capitalist and the Chinese peasant/worker that will span the entire planet. If the PRC declines to defend itself, it will be destroyed; but if the financial oligarchy cannot destroy the PRC, it will lose its own control over class society. Were the PRC an empire, the new Cold War would not fundamentally threaten capitalist rule; victory would simply mean one gang of capitalists replacing another, just as new, ascendant empires have absorbed old, decaying ones throughout history. But the Chinese capitalists do not control finance in their own country, the workers do, and they are not required by their class interest to seek profit and exploitation at others’ expense. A Chinese victory thus has the potential to be another paradigm shift—a progression between stages of history. We have been here before. The bipolar world of the original Cold War, dominated by the United States and the Soviet Union, displayed exactly this dynamic, and the Soviet Union was defeated utterly. It would seem wise to avoid the same situation that has historically led to disaster; but this can only happen if the two superpowers cooperate in avoiding kinetic, economic, or proxy conflict, and the United States almost certainly will not. An examination of the Soviet Union’s errors, the errors of contemporary anti-imperialists, and of any qualitative differences between the conditions it faced in the twentieth century and those presently faced by the PRC, is therefore essential to predicting its surest path to victory.

        The PRC currently enjoys a relatively better position than the Soviet Union at its height. It has a considerably larger share of the global economy and total world population, as well as far greater international trade leverage. Even more importantly, unlike during the First Cold War, it has pursued close cooperation with the Russian Federation despite the differences in the ruling class of each country. The infamous Sino-Soviet Split, which set the two largest socialist countries at odds with one another, has not continued into the twenty-first century, and the super-empire’s open hostility toward both Russia and China make that chapter of history unlikely to repeat itself in the near future. Political strategy, however, may still ultimately be the most decisive factor in the Second Cold War.

        In the first months after the October Revolution, Lenin wrote:

        ". . . until the world socialist revolution breaks out, until it embraces several countries and is strong enough to overcome international imperialism, it is the direct duty of the socialists who have conquered in one country (especially a backward one) not to accept battle against the giants of imperialism. Their duty is to try to avoid battle, to wait until the conflicts between the imperialists weaken them even more, and bring the revolution in other countries even nearer. . . one must be able to calculate the balance of forces and not help the imperialists by making the battle against socialism easier for them when socialism is still weak, and when the chances of the battle are manifestly against socialism."

        The fledgling Russian Soviet Republic, which at first had controlled only the urban centers of Moscow and St. Petersburg, could not fight the forces of every imperialist power at once; indeed, the key to its survival was not war against them, but extricating itself from the First World War as quickly as it could. For the next two decades, it followed Lenin’s strategy, seeking to make peace and détente with the imperialists while it was still weak and they were still strong. Great sacrifices were made to consolidate and defend the revolution within the Soviet Union, to appear harmless before the capitalist world, and to sow discord between the empires, which were not yet united. The Second World War seemed to vindicate this strategy; as the imperialist governments of France and the UK deliberately “appeased” Nazi Germany in the hopes that it would destroy socialism in Europe for them, the Soviet Union’s maneuvering succeeded in broadening the war, such that even while encircled by Germany and the Empire of Japan, it did not face their might alone. As a result of inter-imperialist conflict, the Soviet Union and its sphere of influence expanded, bringing revolution and proletarian rule to Eastern Europe, China, Mongolia, and Korea.

        Yet the Second World War was also the last inter-imperialist war. The Soviet leadership became the victim of its own success, believing that the same strategy would work again under the next stage of imperialism, which at that point had not been identified. In 1952, Joseph Stalin confidently dismissed any objections to the contrary: "[...] the capitalist countries’ struggle for markets and the desire to crush their competitors turned out in actuality to be stronger than the contradictions between the camp of capitalism and the camp of socialism. [...]"

        Stalin did not live to correct this error, and his successors also failed to recognize it, even as the Cold War’s imperialist bloc increasingly became not less but more united against socialism. In 1956, the Soviet Union officially adopted the policy of “peaceful coexistence” with the capitalist empires. Similarly, Deng advocated a foreign policy of “keeping a low profile”—which, after the collapse of the socialist bloc and the total encirclement of the remaining socialist countries, succeeded in keeping the Party in power at the cost of integration with the capitalist world—and ever since his passing, the PRC has officially forsworn seeking any form of hegemony and has scrupulously followed its self-imposed principles of non-interference in other countries’ internal political affairs. Yet it is now obvious from the remainder of twentieth century history that inter-imperialist war was not inevitable. [...]

        [...] The experiences of Japan are the clearest evidence that the inter-imperialist unity that outlived even the Soviet Union is in no danger. There would be no inter-imperialist war in the latter twentieth century, and one is not likely in the twenty-first. The greatest conflict between capitalist empires of the super-imperial era resembled nothing so much as the United States pointing a gun at an unarmed man. There is no reason to believe that the unprecedented unity among empires in the face of a socialist enemy that was a feature of First Cold War will not also be a feature of the Second, especially not now that the super-empire and neocolonialism are fully entrenched throughout the world. The PRC is therefore no more likely than was the Soviet Union to win simply through patience.

        As described earlier in Chapter Eleven, the severing of the Nord Stream was in no country’s self-interest but the United States’ (and Norway’s); pipelines, railroads, bridges, ports, and other transport infrastructure of the kind that the PRC has been patiently and methodically building throughout the periphery are all vulnerable. What takes years to build can be destroyed in moments; without its own military and soft-power influence, the PRC’s long-term geopolitical strategy will soon be at a tremendous disadvantage, and it may lose what it has so painstakingly gained. In any war, hot or cold, the advantage usually lies with the side that takes the initiative. Though the PRC is still rising economically, militarily, and in every other respect, the United States has consistently acted first, through trade wars, diplomatic maneuvering, propaganda, and other provocations. It has retained its military outposts in Korea and is expanding them throughout the Pacific, [...] the Cold War blocs are re-forming, and the PRC is the de facto leader of the opposition whether the Party is ready or not. The outcome of the Second Cold War will depend heavily upon whether and in what fashion the PRC will take on this mantle of leadership.

      • All that, and the US has the perk of not having to fight wars on its own territories. The US fought and lost in Vietnam, Korea, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc., but never on “American” land.

        While these wars have destroyed millions of lives abroad, caused incalculable damage to land and infrastructure, the US public and its ways of life have hardly had a burden to bear

    • I get what you are saying and agree mostly, however I think it is important to understand that war is generally deeply unpopular with working class people (who aren’t fascists and/or settlers with reactionary brainworms) and fundamentally, communism is the anti-war perspective. It is true that anti-imperlialist wars and wars of liberation ultimately serve the anti-war cause, but the people fighting and dying on both sides will be the working class- and unlike other systems, Socialist power and authority ultimately is rooted in the opinions of the masses… not to mention the toll the entire world pays from nuclear holocaust. The US unfortunately had unchallenged nuclear arms for a few critically important years. The first open conflict between the socialist world and capitalist class after WW2, The US war in Korea, for example, began a little less than a year after the Soviet Union got the bomb, and we don’t really know what would have happened if the USSR got atomic weapons later or not at all. Would the DPRK even exist?

    • Nukes would have flown before the USSR set foot in the west

    • The question then is at what point do you think the soviet people would've been ok with invading westward and not revolt, Gorby era is probably out of the question in that case.

      The classic case is 1918 instead of signing brest-litovsk, but that's a well trodden debate and soviet industry wasn't what it later became yet.

912 comments